Read the show notes and download the full episode here.
Michaela Light 0:00
Welcome back to the show. I'm here with Daniel Garcia, and he and I are going to talk about an amazing cold fusion conference coming up real soon. Now called into the box. You may think it only covers box things, but actually covers all kinds of cold fusion things as well. And if you don't know Daniel, he's been doing cold fusion for decades now, probably started bringing in web tech. Yes, decades started in 1997 with web tech, and he loves doing it. He's also a dad got an 11 year old son who's a musician, and he's the manager, or he likes calling him himself, the dad, manager of his son. And he's also a podcaster. DJ has a wicked sense of humor. So welcome Daniel.
Daniel Garcia 0:59
Thank you for having me. Michaela, it's been years since, yes, since
Michaela Light 1:03
we lost on the show. So what is this? Into the box conference? For people, I know what it is, but maybe some people listening don't well into
Daniel Garcia 1:13
the box. So first of all, my name is Daniel gersim With orti solutions. We're one of the premier code fusion consulting companies out there. You've probably heard of us. We're the Box Company, cold box, command box, test box, content box, all that, and into the box. Get it into the box. It's a box theme is our annual developer conference, and so we put it on every year. Last year was the first time you moved to DC with it. Again. This year we're gonna be DC again, but it's our conference to bring together developers, engineers, enthusiasts, basically anyone who works with CO fusion box, laying any related technologies, kind of learn the best practices, networking, discuss trends, things like that,
Michaela Light 1:57
all right. And so will be a lot of things about cold box and command box, and how many box things are these days? Every time I turn around, it seems there's another box, cold fusion library or tool released. Well,
Daniel Garcia 2:10
the quick answer is, I don't know, and I'm gonna get made fun of for that leader by my team, in a good way, but there's a lot of boxes there are. And because not just the main core products, we also have a lot of modules and all sorts of things to get with it, I should have been more prepared. Michaela, I'm sorry
Michaela Light 2:30
if you want that's okay, but there's more than 20, I
Daniel Garcia 2:36
think, right there are a lot the main ones that people know are going to be cold box, command box. Love command box. We love cold box. Dude, content box, test box, stash box, all these, well, they could just go to the website and look at them, but that's less than just no
Michaela Light 2:51
no worries. Just people should know there are a lot out there. And if you know, they may not realize quite how many there are in it. Well, one of the coolest that could be a Go ahead. What's the coolest one?
Daniel Garcia 3:01
There's the newest one. One of the coolest newest is box. Lang, oh, yes, that is our I was talking to Louise about
Michaela Light 3:12
that a little while ago on the show, yeah,
Daniel Garcia 3:15
and so, so just another box that's out there, yes,
Michaela Light 3:20
but it's a computer language like Lucy or Adobe cold fusion, so well it is,
Daniel Garcia 3:27
but it's a lot more than that. It's a language that compiles down to Java. It can be cold fusion compatible. So if you want to migrate over from Adobe or Lucy or anything else so you're a fusion developer, you can do that. But it's also really its own language with multiple run types. And so there's lots of cool things you can do. But today we're here to talk about into the box. And so yes,
Michaela Light 3:49
about, well, we'll ask later, when we get to the speaks and topics about what, whether you're going to cover box Lang or whether it will even be released by the time the conference comes out. But
Daniel Garcia 4:01
to cover box, like, I don't want to speak to releases, but,
Michaela Light 4:03
yes, so. But also just for folks, you know, in case someone is allergic to box things, you know there are, there are regular cold fusion topics as well. So, you know, developing with Docker, you know, all kinds of database stuff
Daniel Garcia 4:25
we do, you know, obviously the CFML and box, like we talked about, Cloud APIs, DevOps, security, best practices, we got some front end, some database stuff, kind of, it's not just, we're not just a run trick, a one trick pony. We do a lot of stuff, because developers aren't one trick ponies either. If you're a developer, you're you're doing DevOps, you're doing this, you're doing that, you're doing all sorts of things,
Michaela Light 4:50
indeed. And then also, the last time I was into the box, when it was in Houston, Texas, I the. Less than 100 attendees. So it was quite intimate. You could meet everyone. You could talk to all the speakers in the hallway track. Is that still how it is or
Daniel Garcia 5:08
absolutely is, and everyone's very accessible. And that's one of the things I really enjoyed. So before I joined Ortiz about three and a half years ago, I was a co fusion developer that go to conferences, and it is very cool to be able to just, Hey, meet Luis and chat with them for a little bit. You know, meet Brad wood, John Clawson, all these other people that you've heard about, and do these really cool things, and just chat with them. And it's, they're just people. They like talking they like talking tech. They're all, obviously, we're all geeks at heart. And you get that opportunity to make those connections. And if you're trying to figure something out, you can, you know, hey, hey, Brad, what's going on?
Michaela Light 5:47
There you go. So let's look at who's speaking. What are some of the people who are speaking that people might have heard of, that they could be interested in hearing from? Okay,
Daniel Garcia 5:58
I'm gonna look at the website really quick, just all these, yeah, as you can imagine, what we do enter the box. It's a mix of Ortiz people or two or tussians, or two genes, I like on the pronunciation, but a lot of artists people, but then a lot of half of its community members. So obviously, for the orders, people names you'd expect. Brad wood, Luis mahano, Eric Peterson, myself, Dan card, Esme, Acevedo, Grant Copley, Jacob beers, hobby, conteo, Jack Lawson, but then we also got a lot of community members, people you'll know, like Brian class, Kurt Gratz, Giancarlo Gomez, George Murphy, Kevin Wright, Michael Rigsby, Scott Steinbeck, so it's not an Ortiz only conference. It's definitely we try to get a really good mix between community as well as orders. Yes,
Michaela Light 6:51
and you had an open call for speakers, I think, as well. So is that still gone, or is it is that closed?
Daniel Garcia 6:57
That did close? We've been announcing, uh, different sessions. We have another round coming up here. I have to check my notes, and Majo our, one of our wonderful marketing people, put together some talking points for me, but we're going to be announcing some of the final speakers pretty soon. All right, so the release would be March 15 for the final agenda release. All right.
Michaela Light 7:22
And when is the event itself?
Daniel Garcia 7:26
So it's going to be April 30 through May 2 in Washington, DC. April 30 day one is actually a workshop day. So if you want to come for the workshop, so you got several really good ones. Otherwise, if you just want to come for the main conference itself, that's going to be May 1 and second, and that's where you have all the sessions with all the different topics as well.
Michaela Light 7:50
All right, so this is a weekday conference, Wednesday, April 30 through Friday, May the second and the Wednesday. You've got all day workshops. We
Daniel Garcia 8:01
do, we actually have, or we call it the pre conference,
Michaela Light 8:06
recently changed to form, certainly. Yeah, no worries. All right, having disabled the smart speaker from interrupting us, I just love how all these AIs and little messages just kind of take over the world. Entertaining. When
Daniel Garcia 8:27
all these speakers came out, I went all in on the Amazon echoes that came out. Loved it. I was in Star Trek, right? I could just talk to said it would do stuff turn on lights. And yeah, my son was just like, one or two. He would hear us talking to it. He wanted Yes, so he learned how to actually talk. Uh huh. Don't see by talking to the smart speaker. Oh my goodness. Love technology. And anyway, I digress. So we're talking about some of the workshops. We actually have four different workshops that are going to be offering on the 30th as part of the pre conference. We've got one development hosting using Docker CICD and AWS ECS. Given that, along with Jacob beers, we got a getting started with Box Lang, with Brad wood, John Clawson and Louis mojan, we got another workshop. It's called just enough workshop talks about command box, code box, you have config, all the different pieces in the ecosystem. So if you're just kind of getting started and want to know how it all fits together, that's Dan card and hobby container are doing that. And then finally, we got a building modern apps with CB wire and alpine JS with Grant Copley and ESME aceveda. So four different ones, four very different topics, um, depending on what you're interested
Michaela Light 9:47
in. And those are hands on. You bring your own laptop with with Lucy or Adobe confusion or box Lang installed in a database. Yep, absolutely.
Daniel Garcia 9:57
Sessions. Um, Interactive. It's not there's just sit there and listen, we actually do things together. Um, right. We bring your laptop command box. That's really the main thing. Is to have a command box, and often a database server, depending on which session you're doing. And
Michaela Light 10:13
then, as well as people teaching, I assume there's like, an, I don't know what you'll call it, someone else who goes around the room when people get stuck to help and get unstuck, yep, so, yeah.
Daniel Garcia 10:24
So, at any given point we have one person presenting and then another person acting as a TA, I guess, Yes,
Michaela Light 10:30
Teacher Assistant, or whatever phrase stands for, so, and then. So the first day of the conference is actually the Thursday, the first of May. Right, correct, absolutely. Yep. And so and the conference seems to kick off quite early, at 730 for breakfast. Well,
Daniel Garcia 10:53
that's breakfast, the registration, the keynote itself. That's a nanny I lack because I am not a morning person. Oh, okay, I might get there like at 840 grab a quick bite juice and go to the keynote. Yes,
Michaela Light 11:06
there you go. And the keynotes are always epic, because it's like a tag team show of all the new features and roadmaps and what's cool in the world of cold fusion and box Oh,
Daniel Garcia 11:17
absolutely, all the cool things we do, things our customers do big announcements that we have, I'm not going to tease anything, because Luis is the person that would tease stuff, but, um, but, yeah, it's not just one person going on for an hour about how cool everyone is. It really is a you get to see a lot of different aspects of what we do and what other people are doing, and products and insights.
Michaela Light 11:42
Um, so what are some of the exciting topics this year?
Daniel Garcia 11:46
Well, we don't have them all released yet. They will be middle of March, but what I can tell, okay, and I'm at actually going, Yes, what is released? Well, if you go to end of the box.org, for everyone watching, you'll be able to see the entire agenda, at least what's out there. But we got things on content, box, IoT, hardware, obviously a bunch of box link stuff, pass key, CD, security using Open API, legacy code, command, box, web sockets. That's just the first day, the second day, customizing your run time. But again, more box links.
Michaela Light 12:21
Wait a minute. I think you missed the evening party on the first day. Getting to it, I'm getting to it. We're getting to it. Okay, okay, just you skip to the second day. So well, you Well, you asked about topics. Okay. I'm sorry, given the Yes, go ahead. Day two. I want to get to the party, but I know network get to it. You gotta build up, right? But what are the other topics you can tell us about?
Daniel Garcia 12:46
Well, day two, just really quick, we got some DevOps, CICD. I'm doing one on that again. More security, some database ones, scheduled tasks, working, doing portable CI with GitLab and GitHub. So a lot of you know different things. It's not just cold fusion, it's not just boxing, it's all sorts of things. But to get to the topic that you're really excited about, on the evening of day one, we have happy box. So Happy box is kind of our conference get together, reception, party. We have, usually some sort of food there. It's a chance for you to network with others and a nice, very more relaxed and formal talk to those people that you maybe only heard about. Want to talk about. More often than not, we have mariachi band, and they'll come, at least they've been. Every year I've been to in the box, and that's always really nice. And depending on how people are, you might even get a couple people up there singing with them or dancing with them. Oh, wow, they get pretty crazy. Not me. I'm usually pretty reserved. I'm there with my appetizer and just talking to people.
Michaela Light 13:56
But there you go. Yeah,
Daniel Garcia 13:59
I went, I think last year Jorge sang with them, or the year before, Jorge sat with the Karachi band, and Edgardo is over there dancing and teaching people how to do reggaeton or whatever. And so it really is a fun time. It's a chance to network and just socialize. You know, we're all developers, we're all geeks, raw, but this is a chance just to kind of, you know, relax and have fun.
Michaela Light 14:27
So which of the topics in there are you particularly interested in, other than the ones you're giving yourself? Of course,
Daniel Garcia 14:37
this year, see the problem with this conference, and honestly, the problem with most of these conferences is you get a lot of great topics, and a lot of times you're at the same time slot. So it's like, Oh no, this, but I want to do this, and what do I do? Well, we solve that, we record all our sessions, and then by coming to end of the box, we will put them on. On to CF cast later. And so by attending it in the box, you'll get a pre access to that once they're released after the conference. And so that's always something. Hey, I really want to go to this session. I really want to go to this session. Well, why not both? Just you might have to wait a little bit on the other but the topics I'm most excited about, honestly, are going to be the boxing ones. We're doing some really neat things. Again, I can't give too much away. You can bug Luis. We still talk your ear off about it all, but it's exciting. It really is, from the Ides to the releases to the run times, and you can do AWS lamb does with it. I mean, how cool is that?
Michaela Light 15:44
It's very cool, particularly as you can't do that in Adobe cold fusion. So yeah, they kind of teased that you were going to be able to do it, and then they pulled back at the last minute. Say, No, we're not releasing this feature. So we won't possibly speculate why they might have done that, but you now can do that with boxing, and I think you can do with Lucy, and have been able to for a while.
Daniel Garcia 16:04
So yeah, there's some things you can do in the but, and then at the top of the box thing, also excited. I'm always excited about DevOps, some of the Docker things, some of the CICD things. I mean, I'm giving a CICD talk, but it's really more of an intro overview for people. And I want to learn more advanced stuff too, just like everyone else, I'm a developer, just like everyone else. Just like everyone
Michaela Light 16:23
else. So CICD stands for what for those people listening who might not know,
Daniel Garcia 16:28
continuous integration, continuous development. So why would you do that? So as a common workflow, say you're developer, or a team of developers, you've got your local server, then you got maybe a development server, you got production servers a lot of times, using Source version control, like, say, Git and with service say, like maybe GitHub or GitLab. While I'd be talking about GitHub, you check in your code, because all good developers check in their code, but when you want to deploy, in the old days, you would have to take your code and physically copy it and paste it to different servers or FTP at somewhere, or do all sorts of things. Well, at CICD, you can actually script and automate the entire process. So now, when I do my pull request for my feature branch into dev it will automatically deploy that to the dev servers and do whatever it needs to do, whether to start services or run migrations or install modules, whatever. And then when I wanted to align with it, I could do my pull request from dev to main. Once that's merged, it could automatically deploy my code. I literally just press a button like that, and it just goes out there to the to the servers. So when you go away tons of servers, it automates, wow.
Michaela Light 17:41
And it does it right every time. Yes,
Daniel Garcia 17:43
it's the same way every time. So again, in the old days, you have to deploy to, say, a dozen servers. Like my last job, we had a dozen servers, and we had a actually, we were doing CICD, so that's not a good example, but if you had a dozen servers, had to manually put that code out there. It'd be very tedious. What if you missed a step? What if you forgot a server? What if you whatever? This really takes a human element out of the deployment process. It makes it robust and repeatable and automated, saving us time to be able to work on things like learning box lighting or fixing bugs or whatever.
Michaela Light 18:16
Well, there you go. So I noticed this connecting to the open AI Artificial Intelligence API.
Daniel Garcia 18:25
Oh, one of that for that session? Yeah, that
Michaela Light 18:28
sounds interesting using AI. So do you do anything with AI, or is that
Daniel Garcia 18:35
art? I really don't yet, to be honest, other than, like, from time to time and play around, like with some tools. I have not got into the APIs interested, but I'm, I am not an AI early adopter.
Michaela Light 18:51
All right, you're in the middle curve.
Daniel Garcia 18:55
I am actually with cups of stuff like that. But you know, I'm not the canary of the coal mine. Okay? The guy that comes in and says, Hey, is it Canary still breathing? Great. Let's play around a little
Michaela Light 19:06
bit. There you go. Are there are the AI canaries and cold fusion lads still breathing? Do you think, or I
Daniel Garcia 19:11
think so, at least I haven't heard otherwise.
Michaela Light 19:15
Well, would you hit if a canary is dead? Would you hear,
Daniel Garcia 19:18
Well, somebody's gone to like, you know, find it like not to get
Michaela Light 19:21
someone else. Yeah, someone else checks on the Canaries. They would speak up.
Daniel Garcia 19:25
But with that session you just mentioned, I'd be lead Brian class is doing that one?
Michaela Light 19:31
Yeah, double check. He is. It
Daniel Garcia 19:35
is Brian. He's a he's a great speaker. He's a great guy. Who's he? Again, I don't want to. I always feel bad saying I want to go to this session, not that session, because I don't want to influence anyone go to the sessions that you want to go to. I don't want to ever pick one over the other and then make somebody feel bad that. Why don't you go mine? Why should go to that one? No, so
Michaela Light 19:56
his sessions about how to connect to the open AI. A API so you can tell your app to clever, cold few, you know, AI things, whatever that might be, whether it's figuring things out or creating images or analyzing data,
Daniel Garcia 20:16
absolutely it'll be a good session, because Brian always has good sessions. But like I was saying before, it's opposite the box or the box link, IDE, session,
Michaela Light 20:26
oh no, because there's a separate IDE for box. Lang,
Daniel Garcia 20:30
Oh, absolutely. Well yes and no, I say yes and that we have our own box. Lang extension for VS code that will enable all sorts of goodness, I guess. Just like if you remember, years back, there used to be a CF builder that was a separate around top of Eclipse, or they have their own brand CF builder. Then they got rid of that, and they moved to having a VS code IDE extension. That's what we did with Box lane. We started out with the old CFML extension, branched off that was open source. Branched off that through a lot of improvements into it. But it's not just for boxing. Can also develop your co fusion code with it. It's got a lot of the same helpers and insight checkers and things like that. But if you're doing box link, you can use things like the step debugging. You can run the service from there also. It's really an integrated, well, that's what ID is, but it's really an integrated development environment extension. But Jacob beers, one of my co workers, great guy, is going to be giving a session at that time as well. And so that's an example of two really great, strong sessions that how do you choose?
Michaela Light 21:40
Well, fortunately, they're recorded, so you can go with one, yeah, so, or you could even go to neither of them and go to the hallway track.
Daniel Garcia 21:48
Well, that's true. Maybe you know, you catch somebody in the catch Brad walking by, and once you get Brad going on topic, Brad doesn't shut up. He just but he's very passionate. Now those really developers that come to these conferences. I'm not just artist people, but in general, they're passionate developers. And you start talking about these things, and you know, excitement breeds excitement. Yes, it's not a it's not a stuffy conference. And
Michaela Light 22:16
yeah, now we've been talking about box Lang. Could you? Could you just say in a sentence or two, what? What is box Lang? Because I noticed there was a Post this week in the cold fusion developer Facebook group where Luis announced box Lang release candidate, one, which makes me think it probably will release prior to the conference, but no guarantees. With beta versions,
Daniel Garcia 22:41
you could put Luis on the spot all you want. But, yeah, but
Michaela Light 22:45
I Well, no, I want to hear from you. Must know something about box Lang. I mean, my point was, a lot of people, when he posted that, were like, box what it's the first they'd heard of it. So although you may be living and swimming in box Lang land, not everyone listening is so just what is box Lang?
Daniel Garcia 23:05
Well, box Lang, we first officially announced it last year into the box the first beta of it. It's based, I'm gonna read the official marketing speak. It's a modern, dynamically and loosely typed scripting language for multiple run times. It's for the JVM. You got lots of, oh goodness, functional programming, dynamic meta programming, a lot of these languages, like cold fusion, it's its own language, but at the end of the day, what does it do? It compiles and runs on top of the JVM Java environment. A lot of languages do that, right? Like Kotlin, has its own thing scale. I think it has its own thing at the end of the day, it's their own languages. But languages, but they could pile down and run top of Java. Well, box Lang is just another one of those types of languages. Now, one thing we do, though, is we have a cold fusion compatibility module that's part of our offering. So if you're running cofusion sites, your CFCs, your CFMs, all that stuff, it's designed to be a drop in replacement, or some of the other engines, whether it's Adobe or Lucy or maybe Blue Dragon. Maybe you're still a blue dragon user out there and you're looking for something or a Rylo, I mean, maybe really old and haven't upgraded in years,
Michaela Light 24:16
16 years. In that case, you
Daniel Garcia 24:18
know legacy, it's people are out there, and
Michaela Light 24:21
there are, I was working with a client today. They're still on SQL Server 2008 kind of really expired. Yeah, they actually did upgrade to a newer version, but they're running into Pat ability mode on 2008 so it's amazing what people will do well, and I understand, you know, when you have technical data, it can take a lot of effort to retest 1000s of bits of code. You know how legacy cold fusion code is? Sometimes it generates SQL on the fly and does all kinds of if statements and other wackiness to create the SQL statement. So who knows what SQL is being created?
Daniel Garcia 24:59
Yeah. Now, to be fair, I'm not going to make any specific statements, but if you're running something that ran on cold fusion eight or seven, you can't expect it to be completely supported with these modern engines. That's the same for Adobe or Lucy or anything. I mean, to be fair, um, so you might Yeah,
Michaela Light 25:17
and you can't expect it to get security up patches either, because Adobe stopped dishing those out about 20 years ago. For that person,
Daniel Garcia 25:27
if you have that legacy kill base, you're gonna have to do some work to modernize it, and obviously modernize your diet. That's one of our big things, where Ortiz is huge on them pushing modernization. That's kind of our tongue in cheek. Modernize your die. But we really mean that we want you to be modern. Use the best practices, use, security, best practices, deployment, best practices, development, best practices. But, um, but with Box slang, and I, honestly, I didn't get this at first, and I took Brad, kind of explaining it to me twice, because sometimes a little slow, but um, one of the cool things of the box sling is it's multiple run time. Now, say you're Adobe cold fusion developer or Lucy developer, and you're like, Well, what does that mean? Well, run time is where you can execute that code. So Adobe and Lucy, I think I'm speaking on a turn here is really a single run time. It's the web run time, and that's it. You have your web application. That's where it runs well, box slang has that web run time, but we also have all these other run times as well, so that if you want to develop a box slang application, it doesn't have to be on the web. It doesn't have to be web application at all. You use it to just interact with the file system and do whatever you can use it to write a lambda that's not a web application, it's just your boxing stuff. And so it was kind of a little bit of a shift for me to realize, well, boxing isn't cold fusion, it's it does that, but it does a whole lot more. And so it was once, I kind of once that clicked for me. Like, wow, this is really, really cool. But yeah, anyway, I don't want to go down too much around the whole but the other really cool thing, but there's a lot of cool things about box, like, we don't have time to talk about it all, but the Java interoperability with it as well. So you could just talk to Java so quickly and easily, any sort of Java library out there, you can import that in and use it. Now, to be fair, you can do that with some of the others as well, but sometimes you have some issues with that, or things don't always work the way you want it to. With box Lang, that is not going to be the case. It's just going to work. We're developers. We've been doing a lot of development for years. We know the pain points. We know what, but we would like to see the language, and that's what we did. We didn't just wake up one morning when I say we, the royal we, but Luis especially did wake up this one morning and say, Yeah, I'm just gonna make bucks. Like, Well, no, we. It was a lot of thought and care, and what do we want to see, and what are our pain points with existing things, and what can we fix? And what would be better? And and that's what box thing came about
Michaela Light 28:14
that's great. So, yeah, it wasn't just pain points with Adobe cold fusion or Lucy alone. Obviously, those can provide pain points for things you wish they could do, but you put in requests for changes, and they never happen, or they or in some cases, you want it to change, and there's reasons why they can't change it because of, you know, backwards compatibility or other things.
Daniel Garcia 28:36
You made a really good point there. I don't want to comment too much because I don't. I'm not talking aspersions about anybody. What I can say is the orders team. We're very visible. We're very approachable. You want to talk to us, you're going to get us. And there's a lot of us. And so one of the benefits with working with Ortiz, are you sure
Michaela Light 28:53
the company name is in the Borg? The Borg, yes, we will assimilate. You. Will be taking over the whole cold fusion world with box. And I will note that the Borg spaceship is a cube, so it kind of fits into this box, metal or, I think it's a secret ploy.
Daniel Garcia 29:12
That is a great observation, Michael and my fact, my wife's the real Truckee. I love Star Trek, but original. I'm an OG, okay, my captain, okay. But, um, that's funny. You said that. I, uh, I'll bring that up. You will be assimilated. But again, the thing keeps mind is we love cold fusion. Cold Fusion is not going away. We're not trying to get people away from confusion, but we're also trying to go to the next step in the evolution of the next
Michaela Light 29:38
generation to use,
Daniel Garcia 29:41
right? Yes. So will you
Michaela Light 29:43
be playing Captain Picard in this you seem to have have the demeanor
Daniel Garcia 29:48
I'd be like the old man Kirk that comes back from generations. Oh, okay, I'm a big William Shatner fan. People have their opinions on him. I think he's hilarious. Like him a lot. So
Michaela Light 30:01
he's a great actor. I assume he is acting. He is.
Daniel Garcia 30:05
People make fun of him, but he's actually a really, he's very accomplished. Yes,
Michaela Light 30:12
he is. And he fought all those aliens and survived so, you know.
Daniel Garcia 30:20
But anyway, Ortis, we're here. You could talk to us. You can find us at conferences. As a lot of us, we're the accessibility. That's what one thing I can tell you, or this has transparency and accessibility. I'm not saying others don't. I'm just saying that's what we have, and I've seen it.
Michaela Light 30:41
So you you, you collectively expressed, you know, what you were looking for in other languages. Some things got implemented. Some didn't. And you know, you decided, hey, let's see if we can do a better job on a modern JVM language and it's compatible with a lot of cold fusion code. There might be one or two features that are special to Adobe cold fusion. I think you guys are working on the PDF tags at the moment, or Brad commented on that, but you know, 99% of the code is going to run fine. But in addition, it's its own language and has its own additional things that couldn't be done in cold fusion, as it is today. And hopefully, with the competition between these three engines, you know, it will just inspire everyone to do better.
Daniel Garcia 31:29
Competition breeds innovation. I mean, we're not out to put anyone away. We're out to just evolve the workflow. It's better for everybody. Competition helps everybody, absolutely.
Michaela Light 31:45
But yeah, I've said from the beginning, this is a great news. There's another cold fusion engine. Because one of the critiques I've sometimes read from people like Gardner analysts is, oh, the only Adobe makes cold fusion? Well, that's a bunch of BS because Lucy has been making it for like 15 years now, you guys are putting out box Lang. So you know, one
Daniel Garcia 32:08
thing I do want to make a distinction on box Lang is not a code fusion language. Box Lang is its own application engine, its own language that is compatible with code fusion. You actually have to install the CO fusion compatibility module for box slang in order to enable all the good cold fusion goodness. Okay. Boxing really is its own thing. And yes, we work with cold fusion. And in your co fusion, if you just want to do cold fusion, that's it. You can do that. You can do your CFCs, your CFMs, it'll all work. But as you're doing that, if you want to slip in some box Lang, box link, you could do that too. And as we come out with more modules over time, I think there's even a python module where you can run some Python code within some of your stuff. We're looking at those things, see what makes sense. We're not We're not a we are not a one trick pony. Not that. I'm saying others are. But yes, cold fusion extremely important to us. We love cold fusion, so bread and butter, it's not going away, but we're a whole lot more. It's kind of like you have to look at the forest on the trees, this cold fusion tree, that's beautiful, but we're also the forest of box. Like,
Michaela Light 33:16
there you go, and box. Don't forget that all the box products without count,
Daniel Garcia 33:22
yep, and all the box products are going to be working with certified to work with boxing. I thought, Oh, I saw maybe you want to talk on his turn. I thought I saw a message from Luis even today saying that they're all updated already. That works with Box leg RC one, but I'd have to check
Michaela Light 33:45
all the box products to work with box, like including command box so you can spin up your little server. Copy
Daniel Garcia 33:50
that absolutely does. I'm saying, like right now as RC one, definitely with release, everything is going to work. But I think as of right now, RC one it all, it's been certified, and all works. And now the latest versions, I will say, if you're running an old version of color box, you might have some issues. You gotta but that should be fair with anything. You can't run old stuff on new stuff, expect it all to work perfectly.
Michaela Light 34:19
Absolutely, I say, try and stay up to date, reduce technical debt.
Daniel Garcia 34:25
Well, this is really cool story. I feel like I'm gonna mess it up. But a big name of the community that we all know is Sean Corfield. He's been around for years. Very smart person does lots of stuff. When we first opened up box slang beta to the community. He got excited because he had an a site that was running on an older version of Lucy, or Rylo, that he was not able to upgrade with the way the Lucy path was, how they did some some things, but he was able to get it up and running with Box slang. And I was like, it's an older site. It's, it's not, not. Necessarily worth it, just to rewrite it all because it works. You know? Why? You know. But they wanted to give it on a more modern environment. So, so he did it. He jumped in. He played with it. He, you know, helped us with some things. Obviously, we're very open to suggestions and comments and but, um, but yeah, he's writing his sign on now, I believe, and this is a guy that knows this stuff, had this old site and went all in on it. Now, I'm not saying he's running it everywhere, but this particular site that was older and a legacy had issues, is now running a box like I believe
Michaela Light 35:35
that's amazing story, and he's quite a picky coder, so if he likes it, that would indicate it's doing some good, good things. Oh, yeah. He's very he knows this stuff well. He used to be on the cold few CFML Standards Committee when that existed so well, and
Daniel Garcia 35:51
before that was it acromedia And part of the cold fusion development for Adobe. Yes, he was so, yeah, he's a Yep. So that was for me personally, again, I'm old. I've been around a long time, like you mentioned, 20 plus years, and so he was a name that I was excited to Oh, wow, hey, Sean's here. Sean's door. This is really cool.
Michaela Light 36:14
Has he ever been to into the box?
Daniel Garcia 36:16
He probably has. I have not been to every into the box I've since, I've joined artists. I've been to all of the one ones last three years. I'll be at this one as well. There are a couple years I didn't make it, just unless you're paying for it yourself, sometimes you don't get to go to some of these conferences. You work for companies. So I don't know
Michaela Light 36:33
why is it companies don't send people to conferences, whether it's into the box or CF Summit East or CF Summit West in Las Vegas, or CF summit India, or CF camp in Europe. I mean, there's a lot of cold future conferences out there, and they're pretty geographically spread out. Well,
Daniel Garcia 36:51
in my experience, are probably three reasons. One, if you've got a lot of developers in your team, you don't have the budget for it, so you're just not going to do it because or you have so many people that you can only send some, you can't send them off. Who do you send? Well, nobody gets to go because we can't send everybody. That's happened some companies, sadly, just don't, hey, it's working. Don't touch it. Why bother? You know, investing in your employees and knowledge, because it works. So let's go focus on, you know, building a new feature that makes us money, or sometimes, and this is kind of the sad part. Michaela, some developers themselves just don't care.
Michaela Light 37:33
Oh no, I don't want to grow, and
Daniel Garcia 37:36
they don't. And at my former job, I did a lot of interviewing. We had a pretty good sized development team. I'd be one of the interviewers bringing people in, and we'd be, we'd interview people with like, 10 years, 20 years experience. I'm a senior developer, and we're looking at the resume and talking to them like, you're a 20 year developer, you're a senior developer, but you repeated your senior year, like, 15 years in a row.
Michaela Light 38:01
It's like the income.
Daniel Garcia 38:04
And so you gotta a lot of developers that are excited about languages, excited about topics, excited to learn things, and then you got a lot of people are just kind of comfortable, and why bother? And so if they don't want to go and they're not asking their company to send them.
Michaela Light 38:21
So I hope no one's listening to the show falls into that slot, or they have a very good reason why they're doing that because of some personal family situation, perhaps. Well, there's
Daniel Garcia 38:32
that too, but um, and as I think anyone listening to your show is probably on the on the bell curve of being excited about technologies and wanting to do things. Yes, go
Michaela Light 38:42
co fusion. CF, alive, absolutely. So they're
Daniel Garcia 38:45
not the people just sitting there, George jetsoning the buttons, and hey, it works. Breathe on it. So,
Michaela Light 38:51
yeah. So, I mean, I know you don't mean the tagline modernize or die for human beings, but your career, if you don't modernize every year and learn new techniques, is eventually gonna die. That's just the truth, unless you're a cobalt unless you're a cobalt programmer, in which case, maybe there's hope. Now, someday, someday, cobalt.
Daniel Garcia 39:18
Yeah, we're joking about Well anyway, the modernizer die. Obviously, it's a little tongue in cheek, but it's not just modernizing your tech. It's modernizing yourself. I mean, if you're keeping up with trends now, we're not saying you have to always do the latest and greatest every day, all the time ever, or you're not going to survive. That's not what we're saying. But at a certain point, there's a series of best practices that I think we can all kind of agree on. You should be doing. We should all be using version control.
Michaela Light 39:48
There are a lot of you'd be amazed. In the cold. We do this annual survey, as you know, the state of the cold, future news survey, and there's more than 10% of people who don't really. Do the control,
Daniel Garcia 40:01
right? And it's like, how do you it's just, I get not wanting to be that Canary, because I'm not that Canary either. But at some point there's a best practice. Is best for a reason. Well,
Michaela Light 40:13
this bell curve at one end you've got the Canary, yeah, and at the other end you have the dodo, the bird that went extinct. So you don't want to get caught at the back end of the bell curve. It could get ugly. So, and there's good reasons, technically and business reasons, why you should be doing source control or any of these other modern innovations.
Daniel Garcia 40:34
Well, there's security reasons for do you be a good steward of your company and your products? But really, on a personal level, this is probably the most competitive landscape that's ever been in recent times. To be a developer and want to be competitive, and you want to make yourself valuable, you can't just sit around and unless you're a cobalt football developer and you've got a very specific skill set, and you gotta learn.
Michaela Light 41:03
And security clearance. Don't forget, that aspect that protects a lot of jobs.
Daniel Garcia 41:08
But you gotta, you know, if the sad reality is, if you lost your job today, I hope that doesn't happen to anybody, but if you and you had to go out in that market trying to get hired, you're going up against a lot of other developers that have already been investing in themselves, whether it's in cloud or DevOps or CICD or security best practice, not just cold fusion. It's not just cold fusion anymore. It hasn't been just cold fusion for a long time. Yes,
Michaela Light 41:38
and so, I mean, I did an interview with someone who had lost their job. It was very sad, and they were working on I helped them, and they kindly came on the episode to explain what they had to do. And it wasn't just their resume and spamming out 1000s of you know, whatever. They had to improve their LinkedIn profile. They had to put some open source code in their git let you know git profile, they had to actually demonstrate they were doing more modern things so and one of the ways you can demonstrate that is by going to a conference or doing some video training, if you can't travel for some reason, but staying up to date
Daniel Garcia 42:16
and just be able to show that interviewer that, hey, I may not be, you know, the latest and greatest, but I know enough, and I can level up as needed and and for me, like when I interviewed people, especially juniors, I interviewed a lot of junior developers, I always look for, uh, attitude and aptitude, you know, are do you have a good attitude about wanting to learn and want to learn things? Are you set in your ways? Do you have the app? Do you have the ability to learn and ability to be coached, that was always more important to me, whether than you already knew the latest X already so you got to show them there's a reason they should hire you and
Michaela Light 42:52
or be promoted, even if you're not in any risk whatsoever of losing your job. You might want to get promoted. You might want to get, even not an official promotion. You might want to work on that cool new project. Yeah, and to do that, you need to show these things and going to conferences, learning new things as a way to do that. So I just want to address some of those objections that some companies come up with dev team is too big. Can't send everyone, so we're going to send no one. Well, I know a lot of companies, they kind of, you know, if they got 10 people on a dev team, you know, three people get to go this year, another three people go next year, and they rotate it around. Um, so that's a possible solution for that. Um, if your company has a no training mentality, I think that was your second objection. You know, no one's getting trained here. Know how no one, maybe you have to do some of this. You know, there's plenty of free videos from the audit channel, the terror tech channel, the Adobe channel, various other YouTube channels. There's the free bits of CF casts, if you feel you can afford the how much the CF costs these days, 250 bucks or
Daniel Garcia 44:01
something a year.
Michaela Light 44:04
You knew I'm gonna put you on the spot. Dang,
Daniel Garcia 44:06
I know. But yeah, what are you doing? You're killing me. Smalls,
Michaela Light 44:11
you can't be a DJ and not be put on the spot, you know. Yeah, just look at just look at Robin Williams in that movie he made about a DJ in Vietnam. That was a great movie. Good morning. Good morning. Vietnam. He was on the spot all the time. He was on air.
Daniel Garcia 44:28
Yeah, I want to say, see if I want to
Michaela Light 44:30
say he, he actually attended into the box in 1968
Daniel Garcia 44:34
he probably did. It's where Luis got the idea was inspired, even though it was before loose was born. Because I'm slightly older than Louis is before I was born. I wanna say CF cast I believe is $25 a month.
Michaela Light 44:50
Where you go, if you so, I think, I think anyone who has a job probably afford $25 a month. Just don't drink a Starbucks for three. Days
Daniel Garcia 45:00
avocado toast. I'm kidding. I love avocado toast. One avocado
Michaela Light 45:04
toast. And you will learn some. There's, like, 400 videos and CF costs. You know, it's amazing.
Daniel Garcia 45:12
Just try it for a month and see if there's anybody watching. And put myself out there if there's anybody watching that really wants to try it and cost isn't a factor. Reach out to me personally, and I will see if I can get you at least a free month just so you could try it
Michaela Light 45:26
one on offer. But I hope we're going to put your personal contact details in the show notes. Daniel, oh, man,
Daniel Garcia 45:31
yeah, my email. Yes, we will. And I'm saying if, especially if you, if you lost your job and you legitimately need help, reach out to us. We're compassionate people. We're, you know, we want the kind of my personal attitude, I think Ortis probably shares a lot of this as well. Is a rising tide lifts all ships, yes. So you need help. Reach out.
Michaela Light 45:59
That's great to hear. But are there, are there any volunteers that see if into the box? Um,
Daniel Garcia 46:05
you know, we've got that pretty much covered with with our own staff, but if somebody's interested, you can reach out. Nobody's ever asked me that.
Michaela Light 46:16
Michaela, right, well, I'm asking you it now, just in case someone's like urging to whatever, and they're in the Washington, DC metro area, perhaps, and or have a friend or family there they could visit.
Daniel Garcia 46:32
I will take that back to the team, I guess is no Well, at least this year, because the plans are pretty well established. But I'll take it back, because, you know what? I am not the I'm not the be all, end all. By any means, I'm just the person they put on a podcast and say, Here, go talk to Michaela and have a nice time. What
Michaela Light 46:50
about students? Are they welcome to attend into the box if they're super keen to learn a modern cold fusion and JVM language,
Daniel Garcia 46:58
everyone is welcome. All right, everyone is welcome. We have a couple of discounts, actually, since we're talking about this,
Michaela Light 47:08
yes, let's talk discounts. I was looking on the website to try and understand this. I found the basic pricing right now is 249 50 cents for the two day conference. It's probably a bit more for the day thing on top. Well,
Daniel Garcia 47:23
then we have the early bird, which expires March 15. And that is 349, 50, if you just want the conference, or 449, 50, if you want the workshop and the conference. And then after March 15, it goes to the regular price of 499, for the conference, or 699, for the workshop and the conference. But we've got a little special thing for you, Michaela, and for all your listeners of CF alive podcast, we have a special 25% off promo code that we are offering your listeners if they want to register for the before the early bird ends. So wow, sure when this episode is going to go live, hopefully sooner than later. But so with the using the CF alive underscore 25 promo code, I'm sure you could put that in the show notes and whatever. Then get 25% off. So if you want to come to the conference only, that's 262 13, or if they want to come to the workshop and conference, it's 337 13, wow. Only 5% just
Michaela Light 48:32
a discount on top of a discount, it's even better than Walmart. And I don't think into the box is available at Walmart, so not
Daniel Garcia 48:40
yet. But you know, Maurice is always that guy. Yes, this wasn't
Michaela Light 48:46
so, so just make sure I spelled that code right. Is it all caps, or is it mixed case?
Daniel Garcia 48:53
I don't think it matters. The way that Maho Ma was one of our wonderful marketing people. She gave me this info, yes. Capital C, capital F, capital A, lower case live, underscore 25 and the 25 is capital capitalized. All right, I'm
Michaela Light 49:10
going to test this out live on air, just to make sure that discount code actually is in there. And whoops, I think I'm gonna check the spelling and put it in the show notes, because the spelling I wrote down was quite right. But maybe it'll go live tomorrow. I'm sure it'll be there. Let me know people listening. If it isn't working for you, I'll make sure to get it fixed.
Daniel Garcia 49:34
Yep. Michaela, know. Michaela, let us know. Or, Oh, yes, oh, um.
Michaela Light 49:43
Yeah, we're only sending out your email to eight and a half billion people who listen to the CF live podcasts. You'll be okay. It's fine. It's all good.
Daniel Garcia 49:53
And again, the agenda finalist mentioned March 15. But wait, there's more talk about some of the benefits. That's upcoming into the box, everyone that comes is going to get a one year free of a box Lang plus license. This no matter when you register which license, box Lang plus license. So,
Michaela Light 50:16
so there's three versions, right? There's box Lang, box Lang plus and block slang plus, plus?
Daniel Garcia 50:21
Yeah, right, yeah. And the way to think of it boxing itself, it's open source. It's free, right? Everyone can use it. Go play with it. Have fun. But one of the cool things that Ortiz does is we have professional services that support our our products, and other companies do too. I'm not saying that they don't. But our box Lane Plus subscription, it gives you, you know, that extra, hey, I need help with this, or I need help with that. You got some benefits to it, trying to see again, being put on the spot. Here, if you go to our well, they
Michaela Light 50:55
provide, it provides support. It's very similar to the Lucy support license, or whatever, or the Adobe gold support plan or whatever they call it. In other words, you can talk to the engineers, get you know, if there's a problem with the language not working, they can help you out. Yeah,
Daniel Garcia 51:12
it's got some other features too that isn't part of the Free To be honest, things like, we've got a code scanner that will scan your code for compatibility. We've got things like, you know, compiler, if you want to do a source list deployment, we could do that with the plus or the plus plus. We've got a some other features that are coming to the plus and plus plus only. So the plus is the first level of support, and the plus plus is even more support.
Michaela Light 51:38
And I just want to say it makes people feel good when you support open source. If you're using it, it's good to support it.
Daniel Garcia 51:46
It does. It really does, in orders itself. We have a lot of charitable works that we do, and so it's not just supporting ordin says, hey, those people are doing cool, cold fusion and language stuff. We're also helping others as well. So you're right. I know you feel good to support us.
Unknown Speaker 52:01
There you go.
Daniel Garcia 52:06
Selfishly, supporting us is going to help support yourself, because we're going to still do what we're going to do. We're going to make cool tools, we're going to modernize things. We're going to call this great educational content out there. And it's a you help us. It will help you. And I
Michaela Light 52:20
think there is this concept for both box Lang and Lucy, whereas if there's some feature that doesn't work quite how you need it, or you're trying to upgrade some legacy code that needs a new thing in it, you can pay to get it implemented now, instead of waiting wherever it is on the back list. So whereas with commercial software, you know, you kind of you can ask for a feature, but there's no guarantee it'll ever appear, because it's closed source, you can't add it in yourself. So another benefit of open source, I just want to get the word out about open source, because in our survey, a lot of people say they don't use open source because their companies are afraid it might be naughty or dangerous, or, you know, the licensing might screw them up.
Daniel Garcia 53:07
Well, do you use Linux
Michaela Light 53:10
on your personally? No, but I have done well I do on my phone, I
Daniel Garcia 53:14
guess rough. A lot of companies do that's open. Yes, they're already using open source all over the place using, you know, MySQL, you're probably using open source. Yeah, open source. Don't even realize it. You got a website with jQuery even maybe you haven't upgraded your front end language in a while, but you're using open source. Open source is everywhere. It's not going away. There's a lot of benefits to open source.
Michaela Light 53:38
I think we should talk about that in a separate episode, though. Let's talk about how people can travel to the into the box. How do we get to this conference if we're not actually living right next door to wherever it is on Massachusetts Avenue in downtown DC, near Dupont Circle this station, I know I've been there. I've been there. I know I lived in the DC area for 21 years. I know that's right. Very, very well. So that area is a very nice area, lots of nice restaurants and cafes. There's that Metro stop you can get there. There are plenty of hotels there, but it's probably cheaper to stay a little further out.
Daniel Garcia 54:22
Well, I remember, was it 10 years ago? Maybe?
Michaela Light 54:25
Uh, cm, I left in 2011 Well,
Daniel Garcia 54:28
I think the last CF United ever that they 10. I was at that one. That was my first CF united. That's awesome. And, oh, that's it.
Michaela Light 54:41
Well, I'm sorry, the the 2008 financial thing affected a lot of companies travel and training budgets. So we had to, had to end. But, you know, we had a good run of 11 years. So where I was, I really enjoyed doing it. It was an amazing conference, and I'm happy to help out. You. Anyone running conferences on things I've listened from it. I was talking to Mary, Maria Jose from autism about, you know, things she could do to promote the event better. Happy to help with, you know, cool things to do.
Daniel Garcia 55:15
Well, it's interesting that, you know, taking our way back machine. But CFP night was an awesome conference, there's some other conferences too, but I remember going to CF objective for a number of years. I go to some summits, another great conference I know, NZ, DEF CON. It never made it to NC, DEF CON. I wanted to, and I never did. Oh no. But those conferences, you know, things happen. Life goes on, and so really the only only three conferences these days. You got the CF summits. You got the CF camp in Europe, and then you've got into the box and those okay. So
Michaela Light 55:51
there's actually four CF summits. I just want to correct you. There's one in Japan, as well as India and as well as Washington, DC and Las Vegas. So they really do cover the world. I may be wrong with Japan, maybe it's Malaysia, but somewhere out in Asia, you're
Daniel Garcia 56:06
right Summit. DF, summit as a conference, you're right there. Yes, it's different locations. CF, East, yes,
Michaela Light 56:13
different. Feel I went to see if some India was totally different. Feel to see if summit Las Vegas, something about the being the lack of gambling machines there.
Daniel Garcia 56:21
You know, they do a nice job at Summit and big I don't go for the gambling. I go for the content. Couple years ago, I was fortunate enough
Michaela Light 56:30
to present, we'll have to give them that for the tagline for the conference. Go for the content,
Daniel Garcia 56:35
not the gambling. Well, it was really cool. I presented it a couple times over the years. And the last time I went, I my wife and son came with and so I'm, oh, nice doing my thing. They were going out. Vegas is also kind of a family city at times too. They they saw the Eiffel Tower, they saw this. They saw not burger. So they had a blast doing all the family oriented stuff while I was, you know, at the conference, doing, doing what I do, what we all do?
Michaela Light 57:04
Yes, no, it's great, great place to go. A lot of things to do there. So just closing the loop on the travel. If you're, if you're living in the Washington, DC metro area, you can drive there. I've driven in Washington, DC a lot. I encourage people not to drive down to the DuPont Circle area if you can avoid it, but it is technically possible to do that. You can take the metro. It's on the red line Dupont Circle Metro, so anywhere in the metro area, you can park your car at a metro station on the in the suburbs, you can drive down. You could take the Amtrak down to Union Station and then take the metro from there. That's another way out to get there. If you're coming from Baltimore or out in the suburbs of Maryland or Virginia, they're also light rail going to the center of DC. The location is right in the center of Washington, DC. Great things to see there for friends, you know, kids, friends, family, all the monuments and whatever, kind of only a short walk from there, very safe part of Washington, DC, so, and then, if you're flying, I don't That's what your hand was doing. There was that, yeah, I thought it was like a seal swimming motion. If you were to swim up the river to
Daniel Garcia 58:26
go to that river, would you? I would think not, but probably
Michaela Light 58:29
not. I think it is fairly clean these days, but there are three airports in the Washington, DC area. The nearest one is Ronald Reagan airport, and there's Metro from there, probably the one with the most flights is Dulles International, and that also now has a metro. I think that goes all the way from there down to downtown. Yeah, I think we built that a few years ago. Maybe I'll double check that, but I'm pretty sure there is. And then the third airport is BWI, Baltimore, Washington, international, that's a little further away, but you can take the Amtrak train from there doing that. And then as far as places to stay, there's a zillion hotels and Airbnbs. Maybe you have a friendly cold fusion friend who's in the area, or family. Cheaper hotels are going to be further out from the center.
Daniel Garcia 59:21
Well, who do you have an orders hotel that were stay at the Royal senescortis Hotel?
Michaela Light 59:25
Well, you guys don't just make box products. You actually, is this like Trump Tower? You have Ortiz tower or something box, the box tower. Don't give Luis. Is it shaped like a box? Well,
Daniel Garcia 59:37
that would be kind of a cool with the Yeah. But no. So they have the hotel this year is actually, like, within a block or two from, oh, wow. Venue last year. It was a nice place, but it was, it was a hike, and going to the hotel, the conference was downhill, so I can deal with that. But going back up, what goes down, you must go back up. And, yes, I. Happy about that, but I did have a really lovely walk one of the mornings with Charlie Earhart, who stayed nice. We had a nice stroll. And Charlie knows all about the DC area and knows a ton of stuff, and it was really nice. But, um, I Ubered back. They had a lot of equipment and stuff, so that's
Michaela Light 1:00:16
another option. You stay a little further out and take an Uber in with some other CFS,
Daniel Garcia 1:00:20
but if you stay at the hotel that we're staying at, it's like a block away or something. So, yes, exactly, but it's pretty close.
Michaela Light 1:00:29
Yeah, I'm seeing you've listed a few hotels, like four or five hotels there from anywhere from two from $90 a night. Wow, that's really cheap for Washington, DC, that's a little further walk. Or the one that's next door 200 night. Or there's a Hilton that's 280 a night. On the deal. You guys have
Daniel Garcia 1:00:55
one quick thing I do want to say, because I know time, is, you know we're chatting, if you're business and you want to send your team we were talking about talking about that earlier, you actually get 50% off your second into the box. Ticket on site. Ticket, if you are sending your team, or if you buy two, you get one free. So if you purchase two on Wow, we'll give the third one.
Michaela Light 1:01:16
So I can apply, I can do the early bird discount, the terror tech discount code, and get two for one free.
Daniel Garcia 1:01:21
Level up, level up. And wow, for if
Michaela Light 1:01:24
we go any further on discounts, all this will be paying people to attend. I
Daniel Garcia 1:01:29
know, right, but if you only pack the house and everyone was having fun, that would be cool. And
Michaela Light 1:01:35
I noticed I scrolled further down the end of the box site into the box org. And I'll put that link in the show notes, in case you don't have a chance to write down. To write down. But I noticed there's even more places you can stay that are even less expensive. It lists some use hostels and housing options that start at $60 a night. So $47 a night, oh my goodness, but that's a bit of a further walk.
Daniel Garcia 1:02:00
So update the show notes as we speak? Yes, but I wanted to throw that in there about the team plans available?
Michaela Light 1:02:09
Yep, no, that's great. So I think we've covered all the things we need to cover. Is there anything else I forgot to ask you? I didn't ask, um,
Daniel Garcia 1:02:17
I don't think so. I mean, come to the conference again. You'll see a cat. We got some rifles. There we have, you know, happy box. You get some swag. You get to, you know, hang out with everybody. It really is a good conference.
Michaela Light 1:02:28
Um, it's a great conference. I've been to it a few times, really intimate, friendly, learned a lot. Learned as much in the hallway tracks as I did in the sessions, to be honest.
Daniel Garcia 1:02:38
Yep, so and again, we're not as huge as we'd like to be, but because of that, you do have access to more people. And if you had a conference, conference, I used to love going to, it's no longer, sadly, around it's called that conference in the Wisconsin Dells, great conference, great technical people. Is awesome. But they went their height. They'd had like a 500 1000 people there. And wow, meet most of the people. No, to be
Michaela Light 1:03:04
honest, a fair number. I don't know what the percentage is, but more than half of developers I've ever met are quite introvert, and go to 1000 person conferences. Little overwhelming, you know, yeah, here, you know is going to be less than 100 people. They're very friendly. So, you know, you're guaranteed to make some CF friends,
Daniel Garcia 1:03:26
absolutely. Yeah, we're going to be going to dev nexus in a couple weeks. Here, I'm going to be out there with Luis and Brad and, oh, cool. You know, Luis is presenting there. We got a we're sponsoring there. We'll have a booth. And that's like a 2000 person conference. I think, wow, there's a lot, um. Now
Michaela Light 1:03:45
if people want to find you online, Daniel, where, what are the best ways for people to locate you?
Daniel Garcia 1:03:50
Well, a few links we could throw out there, obviously, orders solutions.com, that's for orders, end of the box, um.org. Is the end of the in the box website. If you want to find me personally, first off, I'm flattered. Thank you. But you can find me on LinkedIn, just go to slash. Daniel changed it on me here, Daniel,
Michaela Light 1:04:15
Daniel
Daniel Garcia 1:04:18
J Garcia is my user handle probably, LinkedIn is probably the best way to find me if you're on GitHub. I'm Garcia Dev. Like developer. Garcia Dev. I don't really tweet anymore. My Facebook is more personal, but those probably if you find me there. D Garcia at order solutions.com you can find me that way as well. Or if you're on Slack, if you're on the CFML slack, I am on there. My handle is Garcia Dev. If you're on the box team slack with Ortiz, you can find me on there as well.
Michaela Light 1:04:56
Perfect. Well, those are great ways to reach out to you. Thanks so much for coming. Coming on, and I'll put all those contact details in the show notes that will be at the terror tech comm site for the show, along with all the other links and the notes we took during it, and the transcript and the video and the audio. So all be out there. Yes, we're just waiting for the DR Spock kind of Vulcan mind mail to Daniel Garcia to get, oh, you can do the Vulcan hand. Oh, my, ambidextrous with it. Ambi Vulcan. Yes, this
Daniel Garcia 1:05:29
is my normal, you know, out there, rocking out there to shows. There you go. So
Michaela Light 1:05:34
thanks for coming and telling us all about into the box and little sneak peek into box slang and some of the other cool box tools and having a great sense of humor doing it. So hope you come back on. This is
Daniel Garcia 1:05:49
fun. Let's not wait sober years again. Michaela, let's uh, before we can chat again like this. I miss talking to you. This is great. I love that I had the opportunity to come here. I love that you're still doing what you're doing, and you're getting out there and keeping CF alive, and we appreciate you. Yeah,
Michaela Light 1:06:05
thank you. Yeah, I love making time. I get depressed when I see developers. Oh no, this language is dying. It just kind of makes me a bummed off. So it's like, it's, yeah, I know it's crazy. It's not going away. It's and it's be honest with what you're doing at autos, with all the box products and the conference and all the other conferences and all the other new release, you know, Adobe cold fusion 2025 is going to come out like tomorrow afternoon, at 3:15pm that's my prediction. No, it'll come out. They're on they're on their I forget what they called it, but they're on a beta. Do they call it beta gold, or they're on some later box langs on Release, release candidate one Lucy sick came out a few months ago. So you know, all new versions coming out. And I'm assuming that box Lang will do a similar open source type thing where you have, like, monthly dot releases of new things and fixes. Yeah,
Daniel Garcia 1:07:07
yeah. I again, I can't.
Michaela Light 1:07:11
You can neither confirm nor deny might be true.
Daniel Garcia 1:07:14
What I can tell you is, if you see how we handle our other products, like call box, the command box, you can kind of see how we do things at Ortiz, lots of Yes, and lots of transparency, lots of you know that's how we do things. We're developers. We've been doing it a long time, and you know us so and if you don't know us, please come into the box. Get to know us.
Michaela Light 1:07:38
There you go. Um, right. Well, thanks for coming on the show and look forward to seeing you at a future podcast or
Daniel Garcia 1:07:47
event. Cheers. Thank you. Bye.
